Israel urges Lebanon to talk peace

61 votes

news.yahoo.com — Even if the deal does go through, it is unlikely to ease the animosity between Israel and the Iranian-backed Hezbollah, which remains committed to the destruction of the Jewish state.

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  1. Well done Israel!

    Although the description is off. If peace talks succeed then Hezbullah will have less public support in Lebanon. Israel is saying that nothing of contention is being taken off the table, they are open to discussion. Good on 'em. Hezbullah was set up when Israel invaded Lebanon....the group wasn't set up prior to it because prior to it the Lebanese people did not feel compelled to set it up. That is in no way to excuse Hezbullah's actions...they are inexcusable. It is to say that Hezbullah's support increases and decreases as people lose hope or belief in an alternative. Case sample...support for Hezbullah increased in 2006 when South Lebanon came under fire in the 2006 Lebanon War.

    http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2006-07/2006-07-28-voa49.cfm?CFID=2013581&CFTOKEN=84246484

    The short of it is provide the lebanese people with an 'out' or an alternative through diplomacy and support for Hezbullah will wane. But provide them with little to no alternative instead by oppressing and inevitably there will be a call for resistance, creating both radicalisation and recruitment.

    On that note, ever the eternal realist, I propose a different, more apt, description to the submission:

    >>>"If the deal does go through, it is extremely *likely* to ease the animosity between US-backed Israel and the Iranian-backed Hezbollah."<<<

    There....that feels better.

    • (0 Kudos received)

  2. @Albionshores Not to bust on DR, but I do have to say I like your description better, a little more optimistic. Let's keep are fingers crossed that people will get sick of death.

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  3. @mortalwind

    You can "like" his description better, but I present facts about the way the world
    is v the way Albionshores wishes or tries to tell us the way he wants things to be.

    Directly from the submission:

    Israel urges Lebanon to talk peace

    Even if the deal does go through, it is unlikely to ease the animosity between Israel and the Iranian-backed Hezbollah, which remains committed to the destruction of the Jewish state.>

    Hezbullah, the proxy army of Iran, that occupies Lebanon is not interested in Peace from Israel. Their stated war goal is its attempted destruction.

    So you can live in the real world or the make believe one that Albionshores lives in.

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  4. @DerivativeRe
    Yeah, sure I don't use facts or reference things constantly. I just let my comments vouch otherwise for that one:

    http://www.mixx.com/users/albionshores/comments

    (lol, see I can't stop!)

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  5. @Albionshores

    Even if the deal does go through, it is unlikely to ease the animosity between Israel and the Iranian-backed Hezbollah, which remains committed to the destruction of the Jewish state."

    Those pesky Iranian Proxies--all over the Islamic M.E. They just can't keep their genocidal thoughts and
    deeds from spilling over toward Israel.

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  6. @DerivativeRe
    Like I've said before...I disagree with Iran arming or funding Hezbullah. But not to be a hypocrite I also condemn the US and the UK arming Israel and puring billions in arms deals into the region.

    That said....the whole point was that support for Hezbullah would wane in Lebanon with the provision of a viable alternative. That is defeating two proxy administration armies....the US/UK's and Iran's by going straight to the source. Flood the place with guns all you want but if the people in situ refuse to pick them up then they just become modern day swords waiting to be turned into modern day ploughshares. Don't know if the contemporary analogy of rifles and tractors would work as well but you should get the impression.....

    See, empower the people, empower the moderates and the problem of authoritarianism falters. And peace, even the promise or the potential, empowers empowers that movement.

    Besides which if you are going to talk a silly argument of 'proxy-armies' the entire world is the UKs proxy army and Iran is Israel. Google it. Israel has sold arms to Iran and the lickle old UK sells arms to the world. That is not anti-Israeli or anti-UK to say so.....it is positively pro something to point out mistakes so that they may be corrected and it is also positively pro-something to pay recognition when steps in the right direction have been made. Hence my very first line on this thread (post #1):

    "Well done Israel!"

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  7. @DerivativeRe it's unbelievably childish that you went through and downvoted all my submissions because I downvoted this one based on my disagreement with it.

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  8. @calinazaret
    lol, I just voted all your submissions up :D
    I know it isn't the point but still...made me smile.

    • (0 Kudos received)

  9. @Albionshores hey, thanks! I'm glad you're still around. I heard you left for a while? Is that true?

    • (0 Kudos received)

  10. @calinazaret
    No worries babes....I've been kinda busy so I'm around when you see me and not when you don't ;)

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  11. @Albionshores

    Iran is a rogue nation. To compare it to Democratic ones
    is being a hypocrite.

    • (0 Kudos received)

  12. @DerivativeRe
    Not at all relevant to the thread but I'll bite :)

    Iran is a theocratic republic....like it or not. A republic is a form of democracy. On the latest government election day Ahmadinejads party, the Popular Front, won 88 seats out of a possible 260. Next year he faces a presidential election. His predecessor, Khatami, was a pro-European reformist. Perfect system....definitely not. But Republic yes....even the CIA say so:

    • https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/ir.html#Govt
    • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_democracy#Examples
    • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic#Characteristics_of_republics
    • http://www.upi.com/Emerging_Threats/2008/03/21/Outside_View_Irans_election_results/UPI-25251206110415/

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  13. @Albionshores

    The Ayatollahs run the country and the Supreme Leader makes all final decisions--not much of a "republic." You're really trying to sell a bill of goods which doesn't exist:

    Iran

    GOVERNMENT AND POLITICS

    Government: Islamic Republic under Constitution of 1979, with Ayatollah Sayyid Ruhollah Musavi Khomeini as faqih (see Glossary) for life and ultimate decision maker. Executive branch included elected president, responsible for selecting prime minister and cabinet, which must be approved by parliament, or Majlis (see Glossary), elected legislative assembly. Judiciary independent of both executive and Majlis. Council of Guardians, consisting of six religious scholars appointed by faqih and six Muslim lawyers approved by Majlis, ensured conformity of legislation with Islamic law.

    Politics: Islamic Republican Party, created in 1979, dissolved in 1987 because its factions made it unmanageable. Iran Freedom Movement, a nonreligious political party, existed in 1987 but had been intimidated into silence. Opposition political parties existed in exile abroad: monarchists, democrats, Kurds, Islamic groups, and Marxists. Regime stressed mass political participation through religious institutions, such as mosques, rather than political parties. Factories, schools, and offices had Islamic associations similar to mosque voluntary associations. Fervent religious zeal and support for the Revolution promoted by the Pasdaran (Pasdaran- e Enghelab-e Islami, or Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, or Revolutionary Guards).

    Administrative Divisions: Country divided into twenty-four provinces (ostans), each under a governor general (ostandar); provinces subdivided into counties (shahrestans), each under a governor (farmandar). Most administrative officials appointive and answerable to central Ministry of Interior. In addition, each county had clerical imam jomeh chosen from among county senior clergy. Imam jomeh served as representative of faqih.

    Foreign Affairs: Policy of Islamic revolutionary government based on export of Islamic revolution and liberation of Islamic and Third World countries generally. Other major policy was independence from both West and East, especially United States, the "Great Satan," and Soviet Union, the "Lesser Satan."

    http://lcweb2.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?frd/cstdy:@field(DOCID+ir0008)

    GOVERNMENT
    The December 1979 Iranian constitution defines the political, economic, and social order of the Islamic republic. The document establishes Shi'a Islam of the Twelver (Jaafari) sect as Iran's official religion. Sunni Islam, Zoroastrianism, Judaism and Christianity are the only other recognized, legal minority religions. The country is governed by secular and religious leaders through governing bodies, whose duties often overlap.

    The Supreme Leader holds power for life unless removed by the Assembly of Experts. He has final say on all domestic, foreign, and security policies for Iran, though he establishes and supervises those policies in consultation with other bodies, including the National Security Council and the Expediency Council. The Leader is the final arbiter on all differences or disputes among the various branches of government, although the Expediency Council is charged with resolving disputes between the Majles and the Guardian Council. The Supreme Leader appoints officials to key positions including the head of judiciary and the 12 members of the Guardian Council (six directly, six indirectly). He has power to remove the president and is commander-in-chief of the armed forces.

    The constitution stipulates that the Assembly of Experts, which consists of 86 popularly-elected clerics elected to 8-year terms, chooses the Supreme Leader based on jurisprudent qualifications and commitment to the principles of the revolution. The Assembly of Experts reviews his performance periodically and has the power to depose and replace him. Pragmatic conservative candidates generally polled better than their hardline conservative opponents during the December 15, 2006 elections to the Assembly of Experts. (This vote coincided with municipal council elections, and turnout was reportedly 60%. However, election statistics come directly from the Government of Iran, and there is no independent international observation of Iranian elections to verify the data.) Citizens will not vote for representatives to the Assembly again until 2014.

    The Council of Guardians consists of 12 persons. The Supreme Leader appoints the six religious members of the Council of Guardians while the Iranian parliament, the Majles, selects the six lay members from candidates recommended by the judiciary, which is in turn selected by the Supreme Leader. The non-clerics play a role only in determining whether legislation before the Majles conforms to Iran's constitution. The religious members, on the other hand, take part in all deliberations, considering all bills for conformity to Islamic principles. The Council of Guardians can veto any law. This body also certifies the competence of candidates for the presidency, the Assembly of Experts, and the Majles, and it has the power of approbatory supervision over elections.

    The president of the Islamic Republic of Iran is elected by universal suffrage to a 4-year term. The president supervises the affairs of the executive branch, appointing and supervising the Council of Ministers (members of the cabinet), coordinating government decisions, and selecting government policies to be placed before the National Assembly.

    The Majles, or National Assembly, consists of 290 members elected to 4-year terms. The members of the legislature are directly elected by secret ballot from among the candidates approved by the Council of Guardians.

    In 1988, Ayatollah Khomeini created the Council for Expediency, which resolves legislative issues on which the Majles and the Council of Guardians fail to reach an agreement. Since 1989, it has been used to advise the national religious leader on matters of national policy as well. It is composed of the president, the speaker of the Majles, the judiciary chief, the clerical members of the Council of Guardians, and other members appointed by the Supreme Leader for 3-year terms. Cabinet members and Majles committee chairs also serve as temporary members when issues under their jurisdictions are considered. In 2005, it was announced that the Expediency Council, which now has over 40 members, would have responsibility for general supervision of the system, though that has not resulted in any noticeable change in this institution's day-to-day authority or operations.

    Judicial authority is constitutionally vested in the Supreme Court and the four-member High Council of the Judiciary; these are two separate groups with overlapping responsibilities and have one head. Together, they are responsible for supervising the enforcement of all laws and for establishing judicial and legal policies.

    Iran has two military forces. The national military is charged with defending Iran's borders, while the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) is charged with protecting the revolution and its achievements. The Qods Force is the IRGC's special operations branch and is responsible for activity outside Iran.

    Iran has 30 provinces managed by an appointed governor general. The provinces are further divided into counties, districts, and villages. Sixty percent of eligible voters took part in the first ever municipal and local council elections in 1999, though a lower percentage went to the polls in the second round in 2003. Turnout during the December 15, 2006 elections, during which citizens also elected Assembly of Expert representatives, was over 60%. The local councils select mayors.

    Principal Government Officials
    Leader of the Islamic Revolution--Ali Hosseini-Khamenei
    President--Mahmud Ahmadi-Nejad
    First Vice President--Parviz Davudi
    Foreign Minister--Manouchehr Mottaki
    Ambassador to the United Nations--Parviz Khazai

    POLITICAL CONDITIONS
    Iran's post-revolution difficulties have included an 8-year war with Iraq, internal political struggles and unrest, and economic disorder. The early days of the regime were characterized by severe human rights violations and political turmoil, including the seizure of the U.S. Embassy compound and its occupants on 4 November 1979, by Iranian student militants. Iranian authorities released the 52 hostages only after 444 days of captivity.

    By mid-1982, the clergy had won a succession of post-Revolution power struggles that eliminated first the center of the political spectrum and then the leftists, including the communist Tudeh party and the cult-like terrorist organization Mujahedin-e Khalq (MEK or MKO). Assassinations, throwing acid in the faces of women who refused to wear the veil, and other acts of violence punctuated this period. There has been some moderation of excesses since the early days of the revolution, and the country experienced a partial "thaw" in terms of political and social freedoms during the tenure of former president Khatami, but serious problems remained. The administration of President Ahmadi-Nejad has witnessed a crackdown on Iranian civil society, continued human rights violations, and worsening constraints on press freedom and civil liberties.

    The Islamic Republican Party (IRP) was Iran's sole political party until its dissolution in 1987. Iran now has a variety of groups engaged in political activity; some are oriented along ideological lines or based on an identity group, others are more akin to professional political parties seeking members and recommending candidates for office. Conservatives consistently thwarted the efforts of reformists during the Khatami era and have consolidated their control on power since the flawed elections for the seventh Majles in 2004 and president Ahmadi-Nejad's victory in 2005.

    http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/5314.htm

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  14. @DerivativeRe
    Yeah exactly....it is a republic, with a constitution, with parties, with elections, the conservatives try and shut up the reformist the reformist try and change the level of conservatism (just like every other democracy). As your post says there are a "variety of groups engaged in political activity" and both Reformists and Conservatives have recently been in power.

    A Republic, a theocratic one, like it or not. I belive Reformist Khatami recently said that describing it as a religious democracy is more apt. I'll provide links about it at the bottom. I do so again. But anyways Iran is a theocratic repuiblic. Just like what the US and UK helped set up in Afghanistan in 2001 when the Taliban were overthrown! What's that....we're supposedly bringing freedom to Afghanistan and Islamic Republic means thatthere but not in Iran???

    PSYCHE! You doublespeaked yourself!!!

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_republic

    Like I said before...."not at all relevant to the thread" but hey any excuse to dispell a myth :)
    I count 3 from this thread alone:

    Contrary to what people may have heard/promoted (evidence provided in thread):

    •It is extremely likely that peace between Lebanon and Israel will reduce support for Hezbullah
    •Albionshores (me!) does use facts, quotes and references an awful lot (lol, post #4).
    •Iran is a theocratic REPUBLIC, just like some on the so called 'right' in America would like to have for themselves (but obviously they'd like a Christian spin) and kinda like these countries here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_democracy#Examples

    • (0 Kudos received)

  15. @Albionshores
    ooohh...let me just do that one last point again:
    •Iran is a theocratic REPUBLIC, just like some on the so called 'right' in America would like to have for themselves (but obviously they'd like a Christian spin) and *a religious democracy* kinda like these countries here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_democracy#Examples

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  16. Why, if we are already so far off topic, not add that whilst there is a supreme leader in Iran he can be removed and the constitution is set up as such. There's a Assembly of Experts set up with those powers given to it by the Republic. They just got a new chair...as in chairman, I don't mean they've been to IKEA. His name is Rafsanjani. He is a moderate conservative. He doesn't get on well with Ahmadinejad. When he was President he advocated talking with the US and establishing channels of diplomacy. He is best buds with Khatami....the pro-European reformist who was Ahmadinejad's predecessor who had his hand bitten off by Cheney.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SC4WEcBDq2A
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assembly_of_experts
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Khatami
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rafsanjani

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